Login Register
 
RSS Feed Twitter Facebook YouTube

Drones: why they're a problem, and what tf do we do to fix them?

Home FORUMS Robocraft Discussions General Robocraft Chat Drones: why they're a problem, and what tf do we do to fix them?

This topic contains 384 replies, has 66 voices, and was last updated by  leftofnever 2 months, 4 weeks ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 301 through 315 (of 385 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #2134915

    bmc85uk
    Participant

    Not really sure why we’re still going around in circles here, isn’t it pretty much unanimously agreed that camera controls are to blame right now for any perceived strength of drones?

    Not to mention the fact that a build’s strength in BA and TDM/Elim are completely different matters, not only that but group or individual strength. I guess drone’s strength in numbers relies heavily on being able to nano circlejerk and move away/to cover very effectively compared to other builds. Ground just doesn’t have the speed and 6 degrees of freedom to rival so IMO there needs to be an easier way to balance the two. LMH certainly has a chance to help this somewhat but I’m highly sceptical FJ will get it nailed sufficiently. Ground needs to be free to use a heavier armour and maintain most of its speed and manoeuvrability in order to outshine air in terms of tankiness. It can already do this fairly well thanks to air being nerfed to TX only but more armour tiers will allow better tweaking across the spectrum of ‘heaviness’ of builds. Nano balance is another thing entirely but fair to say they need some TLC to make them more enjoyable to use and less annoying to face in general.

    Honestly, I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again; make cam control a module, heavy and lower CPU for ground and light/high CPU for air, or just remove cam tilt in the short run and spend more time later. This still doesn’t address the fact that drones are arguably the weakest they’ve ever been and probably wouldn’t keep up with MSMG hovers and other stuff in top tier 5v5 matches, certainly in BA but perhaps in TDM/Elim too.

    Really it’s just too hard to say, I haven’t seen organised platoons face off in a long time and most of the long-standing/best players I know don’t bother with RC anymore.

    #2134917

    BravoRW
    Participant

    Not really sure why we’re still going around in circles here. Isn’t it pretty much unanimously agreed that camera controls are to blame right now for any perceived strength of drones?
    Not to mention the fact that a build’s strength in BA and TDM/Elim are completely different matters, not only that but group or individual strength. I guess drone’s strength in numbers relies heavily on being able to nano circlejerk and move away/to cover very effectively compared to other builds. Ground just doesn’t have the speed and 6 degrees of freedom to rival so IMO there needs to be an easier way to balance the two. LMH certainly has a chance to help this somewhat but I’m highly sceptical FJ will get it nailed sufficiently. Ground needs to be free to use a heavier armour and maintain most of its speed and manoeuvrability in order to outshine air in terms of tankiness. It can already do this fairly well thanks to air being nerfed to TX only but more armour tiers will allow better tweaking across the spectrum of ‘heaviness’ of builds. Nano balance is another thing entirely but fair to say they need some TLC to make them more enjoyable to use and less annoying to face in general.
    Honestly, I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again; make cam control a module, heavy and lower CPU for ground and light/high CPU for air, or just remove cam tilt in the short run and spend more time later. This still doesn’t address the fact that drones are arguably the weakest they’ve ever been and probably wouldn’t keep up with MSMG hovers and other stuff in top tier 5v5 matches, certainly in BA but perhaps in TDM/Elim too.
    Really it’s just too hard to say, I haven’t seen organised platoons face off in a long time and most of the long-standing/best players I know don’t bother with RC anymore.

    i add compact building as a problem since if y’all really want physics, those builds are impossible and self damaging the bot. lol

    the thing is, no stat changes can kill thruster drones. only by collision box fix can we really get away from compact small build thruster drones. the update that player mention makes drone weak right now just makes them moves much slower but still enough to outdo flak users and add electroplate on the bot with the help of nano makes it almost immortal that not even psk can out damage it.

    #2134918

    bmc85uk
    Participant

    i add compact building as a problem since if y’all really want physics, those builds are impossible and self damaging the bot. lol

    Half the stuff in RC makes absolutely no sense but it’s a part of the game and ultimately that’s what it is; a game. I’d hope we could agree that for the sake of fun we should just try to balance these things as they’re established elements that various people enjoy. It’s not impossible to achieve with what I suggested. You might hate compact building but it’s one of my favourite elements of the game, I hate PSK but I accept that it’s now a part of RC and can be balanced.

    If cam control is a module then it can have a direct impact on the minimum weight and max CPU a strafe drone can use, this alone allows you to balance cam drones exclusively. As for KB drones they are nothing more than a novelty, they don’t need to be nerfed at all.

    #2134920

    BravoRW
    Participant

    i add compact building as a problem since if y’all really want physics, those builds are impossible and self damaging the bot. lol

    Half the stuff in RC makes absolutely no sense but it’s a part of the game and ultimately that’s what it is; a game. I’d hope we could agree that for the sake of fun we should just try to balance these things as they’re established elements that various people enjoy. It’s not impossible to achieve with what I suggested. You might hate compact building but it’s one of my favourite elements of the game, I hate PSK but I accept that it’s now a part of RC and can be balanced.
    If cam control is a module then it can have a direct impact on the minimum weight and max CPU a strafe drone can use, this alone allows you to balance cam drones exclusively. As for KB drones they are nothing more than a novelty, they don’t need to be nerfed at all.

    well there’s that, but we’re looking into bringing back physics right? at the very least respect some of it and make it so lol. collision box for a start.

    it’s not like players won’t find a way to be compact. they’ll adapt and find a way again, but even so, building like thruster drones won’t be around since enlarging thruster collision box would make any thruster drone build be too big and much more easy to shoot out.

    i dunno about cc as a module tho. not much use other than for physics breaking bots like wall copter and cam tilt drones. it’s overall better to just do collision box fix than adding modules that only a certain handful of bot types use. but eh i’m amazed this thread isn’t closed and sent to africa for its salty riches may bring prosperity to africa.

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  BravoRW.
    #2134927

    bmc85uk
    Participant

    well there’s that, but we’re looking into bringing back physics right? at the very least respect some of it and make it so lol. collision box for a start.

    At the very least I’d hope for something more like Newtonian based physics than this arbitrary max speed/boost system we have now. I think that’s what they’re aiming for with more physics focus, stuff like old aerofoil physics and reasons to build properly again. Why should a whole build type disappear because it can be justified on a realism-breaking basis? Why not go one step further and remove hoverblades ability to be enclosed in armour? Cam drones don’t need to be removed, don’t get me wrong I think flying a WASD and go autopilot easy mode turret is boring as hell and requires little skill to use effectively, but the same can be said of mechs except those require even less building or thought.

    i dunno about cc as a module tho. not much use other than for physics breaking bots like wall copter and cam tilt drones.

    So you want to delete physics breaking bots like drones by changing thruster hitbox, but presumably keep annoying, even less skill required to build and also WASD & M1 cam copter rather than just nerfing both with a very easy fix? KB drones need compact thruster placement, hovers used to use thrusters more when it made sense to do so. There’s no point breaking all of these builds when they can be balanced individually.

    #2134934

    BravoRW
    Participant

    Why not go one step further and remove hoverblades ability to be enclosed in armour?

    i’m ok with that.

    Cam drones don’t need to be removed, don’t get me wrong I think flying a WASD and go autopilot easy mode turret is boring as hell and requires little skill to use effectively

    you don’t like it, but others who do still abuse it. it’s a prevention method that has been done to infinity and have you heard of any drones in there, which are compact and agile? if no, then it’s a proven method.

    well i’m no copter main but i think wall copters are also a definition of physic breaking. and with hover collision box fix, they’ won’t be as compact. i’m all for tilt removal, but making it a module? what’s the module gonna be like? (even land mine modules are more possible to do than that)

    I don’t think there’s such a thing as individual balance. all balances and fixes are going to make changes to all bot one way or another. stat changes have proven that it doesn’t kill drones and only weakens it a bit, whereas collision box changes have. and as we can see, the birth of electroplate drones have proven it again that compact build like that is still viable. and this way it’ll also kill thruster uber spam that reach 400%, but well since they’ll cap speed to 100% later, i’ll see until then to judge.

    i’ll say this tho. collision box rework don’t kill drones type of build. it just makes its agility power go down to every bot level (if they still want to build the type of bots that has thruster in all direction that is).

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by  BravoRW.
    #2134936
    MALCode
    MALCode
    Participant

    Just remove the camera relative tilt option and be done with it.

    This thread has turned into one big helium cube.

    #2134952

    BlueFunk
    Participant

    I think this mob wont call drones balanced untill team of random noobs can defeat full platoon of drones from a competetive clan . And thats how FJ tried to make this game for few years now .

    #2134953

    BravoRW
    Participant

    I think this mob wont call drones balanced untill team of random noobs can defeat full platoon of drones from a competetive clan . And thats how FJ tried to make this game for few years now .

    want it even further. to a point where there’s no way of compact building like those ever again. this’ll also stop those uber speed that’s going on. and so the game shall be cleansed from such blasphemous builds.

    #2134956

    TheReD40
    Participant

    Just remove the camera relative tilt option and be done with it.

    This thread has turned into one big helium cube.

    100% agreed…

    #2134958

    StereoMime
    Participant

    Ok. Please bear with me. I have been saying this for many years but noone seems to understand. From topic started maybe 2 or 3 years ago, people would talk about air to ground balance. From my perspective, in essentially early 2014, air was not a problem. My team would occasionally get assaulted by an enemy flier, failing to look up, but that very quickly becoming a minority. In the majority of my games, there were myself and 1 or 2 other players who usually who would sit back and wait…. to see where we needed reinforcements, but more importantly to focus enemy flyers. It was not hard to pepper a flyer from the sky, let alone with a few friends.

    Not even sure where I am going with this, except that we need better accuracy for smgs. there was a single patch that simultaneously ruined the balance, and that patch was the one that also ruined the smg hitscan, also took massive accuracy hits. That patch destroyed robocraft as it was.

    #2134960

    StereoMime
    Participant

    As a drone/flier please iamgine for a moment a weapon that, for a moment, is capable of firing at perfect accuracy, but only for a few rounds, before going to what smgs are now. While full auto they are essentially close quarter weapons. Otherwise, the player has to very purposely press, hold, release, wait, press, hold….. repeat, just to put a moderate ammount of firepower on a target. now imagine we made the BASE accuracy complete shit…… welcome to today……

    We need to make the base accuracy STRONG. SMGs need to do DAMAGE at RANGE again. No longer a simple secondary sustain damage weapon, but ALSO a moderate range ACCURATE sustained damage weapon. this act alone will bring dropnes into line, let alone other acts.

    #2134977

    Lemoncello
    Participant

    As a drone/flier please iamgine for a moment a weapon that, for a moment, is capable of firing at perfect accuracy, but only for a few rounds, before going to what smgs are now. While full auto they are essentially close quarter weapons. Otherwise, the player has to very purposely press, hold, release, wait, press, hold….. repeat, just to put a moderate ammount of firepower on a target. now imagine we made the BASE accuracy complete shit…… welcome to today……
    We need to make the base accuracy STRONG. SMGs need to do DAMAGE at RANGE again. No longer a simple secondary sustain damage weapon, but ALSO a moderate range ACCURATE sustained damage weapon. this act alone will bring dropnes into line, let alone other acts.

    The solution can’t be to nerf drones by buffing the only weapon drones use.

    What you are asking for is the return of jack-of-all-trades SMG, which is already the most used weapon in the game.

    #2134981
    w0rrior
    w0rrior
    Participant

    This thread is soo boring *yawn*… I don’t see anything constructive, can someone please close it. Drones are not the problem, your aim is!.. Git Fuking Gud

    p.s You wont get a reply

    #2135001

    Lemoncello
    Participant

    This thread is soo boring *yawn*… I don’t see anything constructive, can someone please close it. Drones are not the problem, your aim is!.. Git Fuking Gud
    p.s You wont get a reply

    Everyone is using MSMG/ION hovers + SMG drones shit on these = 20 pages of drone whine

Viewing 15 posts - 301 through 315 (of 385 total)

The topic ‘Drones: why they're a problem, and what tf do we do to fix them?’ is closed to new replies.